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Posted in: Comics, Recent Updates | Tagged: gail simone, kurt busiek, scott snyder
Who's For CraftCon 2012?
Twitter isn't always there for the nasty things in life. It's there for the nice things too.
While I was fast asleep last night, a most entertaining conversation began between a number of what you might term big names in comics. Here's a brief sampling to give you an idea. Some of the threads have been twisted and turned a little to fit…
It initially started when Scott Snyder was asked if he wrote full script or plot-first "marvel method"
Always full. Can't do Marvel method.
GailSimone
ME TOO. I absolutely loathe the 'Plot-art-dialogue' method. HATE IT. Hate to call it the "Marvel" method, people misunderstand.
Ron Marz
Why is that? I think is GREATLY depends on what artist you're working with.
Jerry Ordway
It's very invigorating to see things reinterpreted, and you still get a pass with dialogue to nail it.I like full script: the dialogue lets me know what emotions to draw in the characters' faces/bodies.
But how can they know what you have in mind for a scene 3 issues from now that pays off from this one?
Gail, that will work with a steady collaborator. It takes a bit of trust on writer's part.
I try to work in whatever way will get the best results. Depends on the artist and the story.
Added bonus with plot style is that last dialogue pass to make sure stuff is clear to reader.
I insist on a final dialogue pass anyway…it makes things smoother.
Kurt Busiek
Actually, I rewrite a last-pass even w/full script, just to have that last bit of tailoring.
I think all here understand what FITS on a single page, which is important with full script.Reading a finished comic, you would have no idea whether script was full or plot style.
I especially feel comedy suffers in plot-art-dialog stories. It needs the structure.
Understandable. I don't mean extreme plot style, where whole issue is "written" in two pages of notes.
Comedy and horror, in particular, you NEED that set-up for proper payoff.
Not all, by any means, but I think we've lost some collaborative aspects in favor of assembly line.
I would love to hear from some pro artists. Marvel style probably sounds like more fun for them.I like Marvel style. But where, for it to work for you, it depends on rapport & trust w/ the artist…
Is it more fun, Cully, or do you just like to contribute more?
Cully Hamner
I do like to participate, as@ronmarz will tell you. Just filling a shot list isn't interesting to meSo, do the full-script people seem like control freaks to you? 'Cause I could see that.
I wouldn't say that.@warrenellis wrote FS for me, but there was still plenty of room for me to contribute.
Warren Ellis
YOU WILL OBEY ME IN ALL THINGS OR I WILL SMASH shit siri keeps switching itself on wait no don't send
Ha! Warren you were terrific, in giving me space to draw! But many have no feeling for what will fit.
In all seriousness: sure, but that's just bad comics writers, not a fault of the method.
And then you have Warren, creator of the angry sphincter style of scripting…I tend to avoid pages with 7+ panels, because I don't want to crowd the artist. Have to remind myself that on some pages, all simple panels, it may be a good thing, and not crowded. Depends on rhythm. Alex Ross is the same way. He may have a lot of story input, but still needs a full script. He needs to know what the characters are saying for expression/body language. Whereas, say, George Perez will go to town on expression & body language more freely with a plot.
It's like, I know from plotting what the emotional arc of the issue will be, like for BATMAN #0, it's a young angry Bruce, realizing, or refusing to realize X, Y, and or Z. But writing the script, I think of other things that work to underscore that development visually, motifs, like blindness is one in the issue, eye-lessness. Not seeing in the dark yet
That stuff, for me, personally I mean, just for my own process, comes out while I script. And I tell these themes to
@gregcapullo, and let him depict them however he thinks will be most effective. I just don't think of them unless i script
It's interesting, wonder if something is gained AND lost, using prose techniques in a comic script.
It's very possible. I think for me, it's just that the inclusion of those elements -the thematic circularity of an issue trying to include in motifs and underpinnings that give it (hopefully) a rich layering effect- is part of what I love .finding in other people's work, whether by virtue of the artist OR writer. Or both together :)
That's the whole thing, I can't see how to lay and connect all the strings in just a plot.
Phil Jimenez
This really is fascinating! Sorry for chiming in late, always fascinated by writer process…
NOW you show up!
I was/am working. Drawing, even! :)Wish we could all do an actual conference or something…
Dennis Calero
Like some sort of conference place?
That'd be fun. CraftCon '12.
CRAFTCON! I love it, Kurt! :)
davidmacho
that is in fact a brilliant name…
I'd be so down for that.
Yildiray Cinar
This has to happen!Even academic conferences can have a retail component, even if not a full-blown bourse. Attendees want to buy work they hear being discussed, so they can see for themselves what's being talked about.
neilkleid
so it might be partly funded by paid workshops, as well as the retail component Kurt mentions
I sort of gravitate toward@neilkleid's way of looking at it…
…umbrella will always helps us to make the academic part bigger and stronger.I really like this
#craftcon idea, and would love to help it happen. Pros in on this discussion, DM or email me, and let's talk.
A#craftcon would be awesome,@CullyHamner, but I think what would really make it work is a sponsor to cover some costs.
Do it for the public, so there's paying attendees covering it. Heck, have dealers. Just focus the programming on…
JamesDRobinson
Great idea guys. Am I wrong in saying it sounds a bit like the two pro-days of Wondercon, back in Oakland?Pro/Con had more of a business focus; some craft but not all craft by any stretch.
I don't think of craft as academic, so much. Close, but different.
I also think theres cache in it being a con thrown BY creators FOR creators, as well
Creators don't want to have to cover the costs themselves, though.
agreed, Kurt, but which funding organization or entity might carry that cache, as well?
@davidmacho
maybe a bigger con that can be divided in two areas, one a regular con and a completely famous, bringing creators of all kinds to give conferences about their craft.
back, supported by multiple departments because comics has footprints in so many areas.
separate discussion/workshops for separate areas of craft? It can expand QUICKLY
yeah, you can expand it as the courses or workshops grow with your audience. I mean, it's like.
Yeah, def. need different "tracks" throughout the con, each following a specific disciplineMultiple tracks, but not segregated. Cross those disciplines, bring them together.
yes!
True, like how dialogue affects lettering, etc.
as i did in college, you can start with general psychology and then move to the specific areas of knowledge, but always related to the common thread, connecting disciplines among themselves
The threads continue…
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